Hi,

1/ Is it possible to force the download page at least to be https? There are some companies which provides free certificates with root CA in all mainstream browsers.

This would be a prerequisite to pretend to provide safe download. For instance I see the page provides checksums, which is good but is half meaningless if not provided through a secure channel like https (half because it still allows download corruption check, but not malevolent corruption integrity check).

2/ Also still in the download page, could the download links for OS which have any (Windows and OSX) be made into colorful buttons? I believe this simplifies the download task.

3/ If the exact Linux distribution (Fedora rightfully detected, for instance in my case) has been detected, it would be good to have the install information for this distrib at the top (and maybe even the others hidden, unless clicking a "see all Linux distribution" link).

4/ As sad as it is (for someone like me whose first distribution was Mandrake, later known as Mandriva), the Mandriva company has closed this year. The website has been down for many weeks, thus even though it has been saved many times in the last years, it seems that this time, it is really the end. You may as well remove it from the list.

5/ I propose to add Mageia (which is a community fork of Mandriva, born a few years ago) instead. Same install command as Mandriva.

6/ For Fedora, yum is dead. The right install command is: "dnf install gimp" (well yum will still work but will output a deprecation warning and redirect to dnf). Of course, you may provide both commands if you want to be as backward compatible as possible.

7/ Mint is quite well spread too. I propose to add it to the "Ubuntu, Debian" list. (Mint is mostly derived from Ubuntu, except for one version derived from Debian)

8/ We have MD5 checksum for the OSX and Windows binary. I propose that these are also displayed for these on the webpage (since few people will go check the download servers if they have direct links). Probably most users won't care, but I believe this is important that we still do so.

That's it for now.

Jehan

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 10:32 PM, Pat David wrote:

I'm close. Today, I finished porting the old tutorials all to the new infrastructure, and I _think_ I've finished porting old pages over.

For reference, the list of old URL's for the site can be found on this page: http://static.gimp.org/about/meta/file-list.html

The actual list will be linked at the end.

Can anyone please take a moment to eyeball the list and provide any feedback?

I am also soliciting any feedback in general on the site ( http://static.gimp.org). I incorporated some of the changes that jimmac suggested, and am still looking for input/suggestions on things like the verbiage on the new front page, as well as anywhere else.

If things look ok, I am tentatively planning to have things ready to go by the end of the month. Is this timeframe good? Too aggressive? Too slow? We should at least have something ready to use for a 20th anniversary of GIMP (due on Nov 21 based on Peter's post at comp.os.linux.development.apps).

Here is the full URL list (if your client doesn't show the sections, view it at the URL above). Strikethrough URL's have been ported to the new site.

http://www.gimp.org/archive.html (skipping - deprecated?) http://www.gimp.org/index.html
http://www.gimp.org/irc.html
http://www.gimp.org/mail_lists.html

http://www.gimp.org/team.html http://www.gimp.org/template.html (skipping) http://www.gimp.org/webmasters.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/ancient_history.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/authors.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/everywhere.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/history.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/introduction.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/linking.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/merchandise.html http://www.gimp.org/about/prehistory.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/selling.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/splash/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/splash/stable.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/splash/unstable-1.1.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/splash/unstable-1.3.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/splash/unstable-2.1.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/splash/unstable-2.3.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/splash/unstable-2.5.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/splash/unstable-2.7.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/splash/contest/index.html (Seems deprecated - any reason to keep this URI?)

http://www.gimp.org/admin/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/announcements/open-usability-gimp.html (moved to
a news item - not sure if we need to keep this URI)

http://www.gimp.org/books/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/bugs/index.html http://www.gimp.org/bugs/why_bugzilla.html

http://www.gimp.org/bugs/howtos/bugzilla.html

http://www.gimp.org/bugs/howtos/howto-template.html (skipping - test/placeholder data)
http://www.gimp.org/bugs/howtos/submit-patch.html

http://www.gimp.org/contest/index.html (deprecated - not keeping this URI?)

http://www.gimp.org/develop/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/docs/index.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/script-fu-update.html

http://www.gimp.org/docs/userfaq.html

http://www.gimp.org/docs/gimp-print/print.html (I have to admit to
having lost interest in updating this page to format properly…) http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/appendix-alpha.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/appendix-threading.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/chapt-intro.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/colophon.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/genindex.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/gloss.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/legalese.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/ln13.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/ln15.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/plug-in.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/sect-essentials.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/sect-image.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/sect-tiles.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/plug-in/sect-ui.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/python/index.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/python/pygimp.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/python/xhtml11.css http://www.gimp.org/docs/python/xhtml11-quirks.css http://www.gimp.org/docs/scheme_plugin/efficientaccess.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/scheme_plugin/imagedata.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/scheme_plugin/index.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/scheme_plugin/links.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/scheme_plugin/sample_plugin.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/scheme_plugin/scheme-overview.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/scheme_plugin/scheme-sample.html http://www.gimp.org/docs/scheme_plugin/script-fu-gimp.html

http://www.gimp.org/donating/index.html http://www.gimp.org/donating/sponsors.html

http://www.gimp.org/downloads/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/downloads/index2.html (this was an example page of mine - deprecated)
http://www.gimp.org/downloads/install_help.html

http://www.gimp.org/downloads/Linux.html http://www.gimp.org/downloads/Mac.html http://www.gimp.org/downloads/source.html http://www.gimp.org/downloads/Windows.html

http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_400.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_401.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_403.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_404.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_405.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_408.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_410.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_411.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_412.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_413.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_414.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_501.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_502.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_503.html.var http://www.gimp.org/error/HTTP_506.html.var

http://www.gimp.org/features/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/links/index.html http://www.gimp.org/links/org.html

http://www.gimp.org/macintosh/index.html (Obsoleted already - directs folks to the downloads page instead)

http://www.gimp.org/man/gimp.html http://www.gimp.org/man/gimprc.html

http://www.gimp.org/man/gimp-remote.html

http://www.gimp.org/man/gimptool.html

http://www.gimp.org/programmatic/xhtml.py http://www.gimp.org/programmatic/admin/howto.html http://www.gimp.org/programmatic/admin/news/howto-news.html http://www.gimp.org/programmatic/contest/index.html (These links all appear non-functional. Deprecated?)

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.2.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.3.3.de.html http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.3.3.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.3.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.4.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.4-cm.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.4-videos.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.5.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.6.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.7.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/gimp-2.8.html

http://www.gimp.org/release-notes/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/screenshots/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/source/index.html http://www.gimp.org/source/howtos/gimp-git-build.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/index.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/3d_Logo/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Advanced_Animations/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Anti-Aliased_Threshold/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Automate_Editing_in_GIMP/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/AutomatedJpgToXcf/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Basic_Batch/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Basic_Color_Curves/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Basic_Perl/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Basic_Scheme/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Basic_Scheme2/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Bezier_Selections/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Blending_Exposures/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Blown_Out_Highlights/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Blur_Overlays/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Borders_On_Selections/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Changing_Background_Color_1/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Changing_Background_Color_2/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Color2BW/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Coloring_A_BW_Sketch/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/ContrastMask/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Creating_Icons/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Custom_Brushes/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Digital_Black_and_White_Conversion/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Draw_A_Paint_Brush/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Drawables/index.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Drawing_Shapes/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Film_Grain/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Floating_Logo/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/GIMP_Quickies/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Golden_Text/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Image_Map/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Image_Map/bexcolored.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Image_Map/bexcolorpicker-tuthtml.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Image_Map/bexcolorpicker-tutpop.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Image_Map/imap1.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Image_Map/visibone.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Image_Pipes/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Image_Pipes2/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Layer_Masks/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Lite_Quickies/flips.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Lite_Quickies/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Lite_Quickies/jpegrace.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Luminosity_Masks/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Perl-Debugged/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Perlotine/index.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Perlotine/nested.html http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Photo_To_Sketch/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Quickmask/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Red_Eye_Removal/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Reducing_CCD_Noise/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Selective_Color/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Selective_Gaussian_Blur/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Sepia_Toning/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Simple_Animations/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Sketch_Effect/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Smart_Sharpening/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Smart_Sharpening/shortcuts.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Smart_Sharpening/warp-sharp.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Straight_Line/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/template/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/The_Basics/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Tileable_Textures/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Using_GAP/index.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/fonts.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/gimprc.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/gtkrc.html http://www.gimp.org/unix/index.html (Obsoleted? Directs to downloads page…) http://www.gimp.org/unix/man-gimp-2.0.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/man-gimprc-2.0.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/man-gimp-remote-2.0.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/man-gimptool-2.0.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/user_install.html http://www.gimp.org/unix/howtos/bugzilla.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/howtos/gimp-midi.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/howtos/howto-template.html

http://www.gimp.org/unix/howtos/tile_cache.html

http://www.gimp.org/windows/index.html (Obsoleted? Directs to downloads page…)
_______________________________________________ gimp-developer-list mailing list
List address: gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list

I'm close. Today, I finished porting the old tutorials all to the new infrastructure, and I _think_ I've finished porting old pages over.

For reference, the list of old URL's for the site can be found on this page: http://static.gimp.org/about/meta/file-list.html

The actual list will be linked at the end.

Can anyone please take a moment to eyeball the list and provide any feedback?

I am also soliciting any feedback in general on the site ( http://static.gimp.org). I incorporated some of the changes that jimmac suggested, and am still looking for input/suggestions on things like the verbiage on the new front page, as well as anywhere else.

I think you have done a tremendous job and don't feel qualified to contribute.

The Digital black and white conversion tutorial was excellent. My only comment would be to up the copyright notice to 2001-2015

Owen

On 10/05/2015 09:37 PM, Jehan Pagès wrote:

Hi,

1/ Is it possible to force the download page at least to be https? There are some companies which provides free certificates with root CA in all mainstream browsers.

This would be a prerequisite to pretend to provide safe download. For instance I see the page provides checksums, which is good but is half meaningless if not provided through a secure channel like https (half because it still allows download corruption check, but not malevolent corruption integrity check).

Also regarding the download page, checksums are nice, but many users won't know why they are important or how to use them. Step by step instructions (or a link to same) would be nice. Probably different instructions would be needed for Linux, Windows, and Mac users.

I don't understand the point of the long list of tar.bz2 files. They almost look like they should be links.

It would be nice to see a link to Partha's website for Windows and Mac users. Leastways I always refer Windows users to Partha's builds.

There doesn't seem to be enough visual indication of when the "topic/subtopic" on the page has changed. Studying the contents, obviously there's a well-thought-out underlying outline/organization. But visually it's not obvious (well, not obvious to me anyway) where the major breaks are.

Elle

Also I was testing the static website on an old iphone. It detected "ios" correctly and showed the downloads for "Unix-like systems". This is kind of wrong because it could make people think that there is a version for Iphone (many people barely — if at all — understand what is ios, Unix, Windows, etc.).
I think that the detection algorithm should be like this:

1/ if detected: show the downloads for the detected system (that's already done);

2/ if detected and we know this is not supported/available (so we can prepare a list of OSes), show a proper message "GIMP is not supported on this OS, sorry" and below this, the "Show downloads for GNU/Linux | OS X | Microsoft Windows | All" message, and that's all. This step allows to not misdirect the user into thinking we have support for one's platform, in particular I am thinking of all the smartphone OSes (iphone, Android, FirefoxOS, etc.).

3/ When detection fails or results into a system we have not planned, just show a relevant message "We cannot recognize your system in our list of supported systems" and below the list of supported systems, and all the downloads.

Jehan

On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 12:47 PM, Elle Stone wrote:

On 10/05/2015 09:37 PM, Jehan Pagès wrote:

Hi,

1/ Is it possible to force the download page at least to be https? There are some companies which provides free certificates with root CA in all mainstream browsers.

This would be a prerequisite to pretend to provide safe download. For instance I see the page provides checksums, which is good but is half meaningless if not provided through a secure channel like https (half because it still allows download corruption check, but not malevolent corruption integrity check).

Also regarding the download page, checksums are nice, but many users won't know why they are important or how to use them. Step by step instructions (or a link to same) would be nice. Probably different instructions would be needed for Linux, Windows, and Mac users.

I don't understand the point of the long list of tar.bz2 files. They almost look like they should be links.

It would be nice to see a link to Partha's website for Windows and Mac users. Leastways I always refer Windows users to Partha's builds.

There doesn't seem to be enough visual indication of when the "topic/subtopic" on the page has changed. Studying the contents, obviously there's a well-thought-out underlying outline/organization. But visually it's not obvious (well, not obvious to me anyway) where the major breaks are.

Elle

_______________________________________________ gimp-developer-list mailing list
List address: gimp-developer-list@gnome.org List membership: https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list List archives: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-developer-list

* Pat David [10-06-15 10:55]:

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 8:38 PM Jehan Pags wrote:

[...]

7/ Mint is quite well spread too. I propose to add it to the "Ubuntu, Debian" list. (Mint is mostly derived from Ubuntu, except for one version derived from Debian)

I agree, and will add it to the list! Thank you so much for taking the time to have a look and provide detailed feedback!

Er, ?? openSUSE ?? :^)

(paka)Patrick Shanahan       Plainfield, Indiana, USA          @ptilopteri
http://en.opensuse.org    openSUSE Community Member    facebook/ptilopteri
http://wahoo.no-ip.org        Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2
Registered Linux User #207535                    @ http://linuxcounter.net

Hi,
I've began now read some of these old posts... are very interesting and they are put an interesting light in the application name question... many times I did read in this mailing list discussions very interesting about this issue.
My suggestion is to create some anchored links from the 'introduction.html' or a bracket, e.g. [to know more about GIMP acronym] to the the 'ancient_history.html' where was decided the name.

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 5:32 PM, Pat David wrote:

http://www.gimp.org/about/ancient_history.html

http://www.gimp.org/about/introduction.html

Hi,

On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 4:52 PM, Pat David wrote:

Awesome feedback! (I thrive on having a task list in front of me!) :D

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 8:38 PM Jehan Pagès wrote:

Hi,

1/ Is it possible to force the download page at least to be https? There are some companies which provides free certificates with root CA in all mainstream browsers.

This would be a prerequisite to pretend to provide safe download. For instance I see the page provides checksums, which is good but is half meaningless if not provided through a secure channel like https (half because it still allows download corruption check, but not malevolent corruption integrity check).

I agree, but this is not a thing that I can do personally. I'd refer to the big gimper, schumaml to find out what the best course of action might be here? Not sure who best to obtain a cert through for our use. If we do get

The most common CA giving free certs is startSSL: http://www.startssl.com/ The free certs are 1-year and no-wildcards only. But I'm thinking they may offer help for a project such as GIMP and could provide some certs with advanced features if we contact them.

Other than this, there is Let's Encrypt (https://letsencrypt.org/), a project driven by Mozilla among other entities, which aims at providing free certs for everyone. But their root certs are not yet in any browser. Right now this is still in "test" state, thus not usable by gimp.org. Yet we may keep an eye there.

one, then it would make more sense to simply use it across the entire site when we implement.

Yes of course, it would be good to have it everywhere. But this may not be mandatory everywhere. But for the download page, it has to, in my opinion. In other words, going to http://static.gimp.org/downloads/ should be impossible and automatically redirect to https://static.gimp.org/downloads/
This is a basic security mesure. If we allow access to a non-encrypted version of the download page, this is like a house with a steel security door and a wood broken door: malevolent people can still use the wood broken door and the other door is as good as decoration. In software terms, malevolent people can just do man-in-the-middle attacks on the non-https page.

But yeah making https mandatory everywhere is even better and very easy to do (that's a web server configuration).

Jehan

2/ Also still in the download page, could the download links for OS which have any (Windows and OSX) be made into colorful buttons? I believe this simplifies the download task.

Yes, absolutely. Now that the porting is mostly done, I can start focusing on styling elements of the page like the download links (they are cute buttons on the current WGO, I'll aim for something in a similar vein for SGO.

3/ If the exact Linux distribution (Fedora rightfully detected, for instance in my case) has been detected, it would be good to have the install information for this distrib at the top (and maybe even the others hidden, unless clicking a "see all Linux distribution" link).

I think this is a good idea as well, and will look into expanding the detection/show logic to capture more specific instances like this.

4/ As sad as it is (for someone like me whose first distribution was Mandrake, later known as Mandriva), the Mandriva company has closed this year. The website has been down for many weeks, thus even though it has been saved many times in the last years, it seems that this time, it is really the end. You may as well remove it from the list.

5/ I propose to add Mageia (which is a community fork of Mandriva, born a few years ago) instead. Same install command as Mandriva.

I'm not sure if we want to remove mention of Mandriva completely for historical reasons? (I'm genuinely not sure - my first gut instinct is to remove it for the reasons you've listed, and replace it with the Mageia reference. If anyone has a different thought let me know - otherwise I'm going with your suggestion).

6/ For Fedora, yum is dead. The right install command is: "dnf install gimp" (well yum will still work but will output a deprecation warning and redirect to dnf). Of course, you may provide both commands if you want to be as backward compatible as possible.

Thank you, I'll update accordingly!

7/ Mint is quite well spread too. I propose to add it to the "Ubuntu, Debian" list. (Mint is mostly derived from Ubuntu, except for one version derived from Debian)

I agree, and will add it to the list! Thank you so much for taking the time to have a look and provide detailed feedback!

I second https://letsencrypt.org/

It's a free and open product, that's exactly what we need, and the new website probably won't be live before they are at general availability anyways.

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 11:59 PM, Owen Cook wrote:

I'm close. Today, I finished porting the old tutorials all to the new infrastructure, and I _think_ I've finished porting old pages over.

For reference, the list of old URL's for the site can be found on this page: http://static.gimp.org/about/meta/file-list.html

The actual list will be linked at the end.

Can anyone please take a moment to eyeball the list and provide any feedback?

I am also soliciting any feedback in general on the site ( http://static.gimp.org). I incorporated some of the changes that jimmac suggested, and am still looking for input/suggestions on things like the verbiage on the new front page, as well as anywhere else.

I think you have done a tremendous job and don't feel qualified to contribute.

The Digital black and white conversion tutorial was excellent. My only comment would be to up the copyright notice to 2001-2015

Owen

_______________________________________________ gimp-web-list mailing list
gimp-web-list@gnome.org
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-web-list