Date: Fri, 12 Feb 2016 19:59:59 +0100 From: forums@gimpusers.com
To: gimp-user-list@gnome.org
CC: notifications@gimpusers.com
Subject: [Gimp-user] How to shrink photo, retain quality?? Business card design

Hi guys!

I'm an amateur photo-editor, and have a decent understanding of Gimp basics.

I am designing a business card for myself to be uploaded to gotprint.com

I am using a 2.5inx3.5in. vertical layout. In the past I have used the basic online editor provided by gotprint to design a logo, this time I wanted to do it on Gimp to leave myself more options for editing.

I need to include a photo of myself on the card....

Short, witty answer: Your image canvas is too small, you need to think bigger.

Long answer:

Since this is a project that will ultimately be put onto physical media (i.e. business cards), you need to think about your image less in terms of its raw pixels (as shown in GIMP) and more in terms of its physical printed size. An important thing to note is that the preferred "dots per inch" setting (the conversion between image pixels and real world) is generally MUCH higher for print processes than computer displays -- a computer monitor might have a resolution of, say, 72 pixels per inch (hold a ruler up to your screen if you want to measure it yourself), but printing processes demand a resolution like 300 or 600 dpi, which is at least four times larger.

So if you want to create your business card as a GIMP image, the FIRST thing you need to do is set your DPI. You can check (and change) the dpi setting on your GIMP image from the Image > "Print Size..." menu option. Keep in mind this doesn't actually change the raw 'pixel size' of the image (i.e. how it appears displayed in GIMP), it only calibrates how the pixel size translates to physical size. You can also set an image's DPI setting from the Image > "Resize..." command, however, to truly resize an image to a specific resolution you will also need to ensure the target size shown in that dialog is displayed in physical units (not percent or pixels!) .

To reduce some of the work ... if your business card will be 2.5x3.5" (portrait) and you need a print resolution of 300dpi, your whole image must be 750x1050 pixels; if you want a print resolution of 600dpi then your whole image must be 1500x2100 pixels. Then zoom out until the entire image canvas fits in the GIMP display. NOW you can begin drawing what the card looks like, add your photo to it (as a layer, of course), and worry about resizing the photo to match the rest of the card. Try to keep the number of resizes on the photo layer to a minimum -- i.e. if you resized the photo layer but didn't like the result, Undo the resize before you try again.

Alternately, if you want to create a business card without having to worry about specifying a fixed print resolution (dpi), you should probably be drawing it in a different app, like the vector editor Inkscape. Vector editors have the advantage of being able to freely scale elements placed on the canvas without losing detail (vector elements are geometric, not pixel based), but the tradeoff is you probably can't submit the vector file directly for the final processing step (you'll need to do a rasterization/bitmap export for that purpose -- which involves specifying the desired target size, either in terms of pixel dimensions or dpi).

-- Stratadrake strata_ranger@hotmail.com
--------------------
Numbers may not lie, but neither do they tell the whole truth.

Hi,

additionally to Richards advice:

On 12.2.2016 at 7:59 PM Joeyf wrote:

How can I shrink a large photo of myself at 2800x4200 pixels to fit vertically on a business card that is 2.5"x3.5" (around 200x150 pixels) without losing quality? I know whenever an image is resized quality will be lost, so how to other companies fit images of people on business cards that look good?

I don't know how other companies do this job, but I'm sure there are many ways to do it.
The GIMP way is to use Image -> Scale Image ..., the Scale Tool or Layer -> Scale Layer AND use a suitable interpolation. Interpolation=None gives the worst results. I would recommend Sinc (Lanczos3) or Cubic. If none of the interpolation methods returns acceptable results, you could try the following plug-ins:

Scale2x: http://registry.gimp.org/node/24746 Scale in steps: http://registry.gimp.org/node/9676

GIMP 2.9 has dropped the 'Sinc (Lanczos3)' method (why?), but has 'NoHalo' and 'LoHalo' now.
Your preferred Raw converter or ImageMagick could also be a choice.

BTW I could not find any Downscale method in the G'Mic plug-in, which usually adds some more interesting filters. Have I missed something?

I'm interested to read what finally did a good job for you.

Greetings

Sven

******************************************************** Sie interessieren sich fr wunderschne Malereien, Mrchenbcher und Heimtextilien?
Dann schauen Sie mal rein: http://www.unikate4you.de !

I checked the Gotprint site. PDF is an acceptable format to send to them. When I design magazines I send out PDFs to the printers.

Photos should be 300 dpi, CMYK tiffs if you can, not jpegs. "RGB must be converted to CMYK for print." Artwork CMYK, 600 dpi or better. Output all to PDF if you can. No compression, i.e. highest resolution.

Rick

-----Original Message----- From: JoeyF
Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 1:59 PM To: gimp-user-list@gnome.org
Cc: notifications@gimpusers.com
Subject: [Gimp-user] How to shrink photo,retain quality?? Business card design

Hi guys!

I'm an amateur photo-editor, and have a decent understanding of Gimp basics.

I am designing a business card for myself to be uploaded to gotprint.com

I am using a 2.5inx3.5in. vertical layout. In the past I have used the basic online editor provided by gotprint to design a logo, this time I wanted to do it
on Gimp to leave myself more options for editing.

I need to include a photo of myself on the card. I have a hq photo taken by a
Canon DSLR, and it looks great. When I create a new project on Gimp to the specific size of 2.5"x3.5" I have to shrink the image down, as it is around 2800x4200 pixels. Whenever I do this I lose A LOT of quality.

etc.

On 02/13/2016 11:04 AM, Rick Strong wrote:

I checked the Gotprint site. PDF is an acceptable format to send to them. When I design magazines I send out PDFs to the printers.

Photos should be 300 dpi, CMYK tiffs if you can, not jpegs. "RGB must be converted to CMYK for print." Artwork CMYK, 600 dpi or better. Output all to PDF if you can. No compression, i.e. highest resolution.

My installation of GIMP 2.8.10 throws an error message and writes an empty file when I try to export to PDF. I don't normally do that, so I never noticed until just now.

Scribus is really the "right tool" for a PDFing job. You can tweak everything about the PDF file - size of print area, DPI, how embedded images are saved, vectorization of fonts, etc., via the document and export settings. I use PNG files for image content when assembling layouts in Scribus.

http://www.scribus.net/

Inkscape completes a "trinity" of Free graphics power tools: It's a vector editor, for tasks like making logos that will be re-used at many sizes in many formats, labels for offset printing, silk screen designs, etc. Inkscape can export its native vector files, with or without embedded bitmaps, to PDF.

https://inkscape.org/en/

:o)

Scribus and Inkscape are both good programs, which I have recently discovered from Simon Budig on this list.

Do the vector stuff in Inkscape and the pixel stuff in Gimp, then do your layouts in Scribus.

Don't forget to convert the RGB image/photo file to CMYK (4 colour) colour space for print.
You might try www.rgb2cmyk.org to make that conversion before you place it in the Scribus layout.
I haven't tried the service, but it's worth a shot.

Output the photo to CMYK Tiff.

Rick

-----Original Message----- From: Steve Kinney
Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2016 4:07 PM To: gimp-user-list@gnome.org
Subject: Re: [Gimp-user] How to shrink photo, retain quality?? Business card design

On 02/13/2016 11:04 AM, Rick Strong wrote:

I checked the Gotprint site. PDF is an acceptable format to send to them. When I design magazines I send out PDFs to the printers.

Photos should be 300 dpi, CMYK tiffs if you can, not jpegs. "RGB must be converted to CMYK for print." Artwork CMYK, 600 dpi or better. Output all to PDF if you can. No compression, i.e. highest resolution.

My installation of GIMP 2.8.10 throws an error message and writes an empty file when I try to export to PDF. I don't normally do that, so I never noticed until just now.

Scribus is really the "right tool" for a PDFing job. You can tweak everything about the PDF file - size of print area, DPI, how embedded images are saved, vectorization of fonts, etc., via the document and export settings. I use PNG files for image content when assembling layouts in Scribus.

http://www.scribus.net/

Inkscape completes a "trinity" of Free graphics power tools: It's a vector editor, for tasks like making logos that will be re-used at many sizes in many formats, labels for offset printing, silk screen designs, etc. Inkscape can export its native vector files, with or without embedded bitmaps, to PDF.

https://inkscape.org/en/

:o)

You can use Separate+ for GIMP to convert RGB to CMYK.

On Sun, Feb 14, 2016 at 7:29 PM, Rick Strong wrote:

Scribus and Inkscape are both good programs, which I have recently discovered from Simon Budig on this list.

Do the vector stuff in Inkscape and the pixel stuff in Gimp, then do your layouts in Scribus.

Don't forget to convert the RGB image/photo file to CMYK (4 colour) colour space for print.
You might try www.rgb2cmyk.org to make that conversion before you place it in the Scribus layout.
I haven't tried the service, but it's worth a shot.

Output the photo to CMYK Tiff.

Rick

-----Original Message----- From: Steve Kinney Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2016 4:07 PM To: gimp-user-list@gnome.org
Subject: Re: [Gimp-user] How to shrink photo, retain quality?? Business card design

On 02/13/2016 11:04 AM, Rick Strong wrote:

I checked the Gotprint site. PDF is an acceptable format to send to them. When I design magazines I send out PDFs to the printers.

Photos should be 300 dpi, CMYK tiffs if you can, not jpegs. "RGB must be converted to CMYK for print." Artwork CMYK, 600 dpi or better. Output all to PDF if you can. No compression, i.e. highest resolution.

My installation of GIMP 2.8.10 throws an error message and writes an empty file when I try to export to PDF. I don't normally do that, so I never noticed until just now.

Scribus is really the "right tool" for a PDFing job. You can tweak everything about the PDF file - size of print area, DPI, how embedded images are saved, vectorization of fonts, etc., via the document and export settings. I use PNG files for image content when assembling layouts in Scribus.

http://www.scribus.net/

Inkscape completes a "trinity" of Free graphics power tools: It's a vector editor, for tasks like making logos that will be re-used at many sizes in many formats, labels for offset printing, silk screen designs, etc. Inkscape can export its native vector files, with or without embedded bitmaps, to PDF.

https://inkscape.org/en/

:o)

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On 02/14/2016 07:29 PM, Rick Strong wrote:

Scribus and Inkscape are both good programs, which I have recently discovered from Simon Budig on this list.

Do the vector stuff in Inkscape and the pixel stuff in Gimp, then do your layouts in Scribus.

Don't forget to convert the RGB image/photo file to CMYK (4 colour) colour space for print.
You might try www.rgb2cmyk.org to make that conversion before you place it in the Scribus layout.
I haven't tried the service, but it's worth a shot.

Output the photo to CMYK Tiff.

I'm not sure that converting images from RGB to CMYK and exporting to TIFF serves any real purpose. I used to do that - up until about ten years ago - but none of the print shops I have had dealings with since require it. PDF makes it a moot point, in the sense that print shops will not know the difference between a PDF file with embedded PNG or TIFF files.

Monitors can only present RGB outputs; when editing a CMYK file, CMYK color is exported to RGB before the image appears on the screen. Accurate color adjustments to CMYK files are only possible if one has the production printer (or its identical twin) at hand to produce proofs; in that case one can print the image, tweak the image, print it again, tweak it some more etc. until the printed version is "just right" - even if it looks wrong when viewed on the monitor.

Is it better to export an RGB image to CYMK format in one's own home or office, or to allow the driver that runs the printer at the print shop do it automatically? Allowing a software driver expressly designed to work with the printer producing the hard copy to do the conversion on the fly seems like a good idea in theory. In practice, I have seen no difference in the end product either way. Variations in RGB color presentation from monitor to monitor are a much more important issue either way.

In a worse case scenario, i.e. your monitor is way out of calibration and the image you want printed reflects your monitor's presentation errors, the print shop people may have to make color adjustments after they see the proofs. (Here comes a big labor charge...) If they don't know how to convert your submitted files to CMYK, or believe / pretend that this imposes a hardship on them or takes more than a few seconds of work, a much bigger problem than a file format issue is present...

:o)

As always, the best thing to do is work closely with your printer and give them what they want.

The printer that JoeyF is using, gotprint, wants CMYK. Here's a reference from the gotprint web site: "We require that you provide us with print-ready digital files in CMYK color mode. Provide all black and white artwork in grayscale color mode. We do not accept any other color mode." They also want 350 dpi photos/images: "In order for an image to print correctly, all file formats must be submitted at a resolution of 350 dpi at 100% of the final print size." 300 dpi works for me, and 350 is even better.

See: http://www.gotprint.com/store/preparing-files.html See: "What type of print-ready file formats are acceptable for uploads?" for a comparison of the formats.

Cheers, Rick

-----Original Message----- From: Steve Kinney
Sent: Monday, February 15, 2016 4:22 AM To: GIMP User List
Subject: Re: [Gimp-user] How to shrink photo, retain quality?? Business card design

snip

I'm not sure that converting images from RGB to CMYK and exporting to TIFF serves any real purpose. I used to do that - up until about ten years ago - but none of the print shops I have had dealings with since require it. PDF makes it a moot point, in the sense that print shops will not know the difference between a PDF file with embedded PNG or TIFF files.

snip

El lun, 15-02-2016 a las 10:35 -0500, Rick Strong escribió:

As always, the best thing to do is work closely with your printer and give 
them what they want.

In that case, the only program capable of producing such PDF is Scribus (inkscape can't export CMYK PDF).
It's important to note that you don't need to convert the images using a different application. You can create your artwork and images in RGB and let scribus do the conversion to CMYK during the PDF export. In Scribus, when you choose "Printer" as output for PDF, it will convert all the assets (swatches and images) to CMYK, even when they are RGB in your working document.
It's also important to note that different PDF and PDF/X versions allow different color models. Some of them allow only CMYK, others allow CMYK or RGB, and other even allow to have both, RGB and CMYK elements in the same document.

In my experience, woring in scribus with RGB and then exporting from PDF version 1.4 and choosing "printer" as output produces a solid PDF that every print shop will accept without questions. 

The upcoming versions of Scribus will allow PDF/X, which is a variant of PDF specially taylored for printing, but meanwhile the settings offered above are fine.

Just keep in mind to set the right color profiles in the color management section of the preferences so the conversions are properly managed, according to the colorspace provided by your print supplier.

TL;DR: Use Scribus, export PDF 1.4, choose "printer" as output and don't convert stuff to CMYK, Scribus will do it for anything that is not in the printer colorspace already.

BTW, since this is the GIMP mailing list, keep in mind that you can produce files for print from GIMP, but you can't produce a CMYK PDF. You can, however, produce a CMYK TIFF file with GIMP and the Separate+ Plugin that should be acceptable for printing (unless it has a lot of small text, in which case a vector format is more suitable and easier to handle).

Gez.

El lun, 15-02-2016 a las 10:35 -0500, Rick Strong escribió:

As always, the best thing to do is work closely with your printer and give 
them what they want.

In that case, the only program capable of producing such PDF is Scribus (inkscape can't export CMYK PDF).
It's important to note that you don't need to convert the images using a different application. You can create your artwork and images in RGB and let scribus do the conversion to CMYK during the PDF export. In Scribus, when you choose "Printer" as output for PDF, it will convert all the assets (swatches and images) to CMYK, even when they are RGB in your working document.
It's also important to note that different PDF and PDF/X versions allow different color models. Some of them allow only CMYK, others allow CMYK or RGB, and other even allow to have both, RGB and CMYK elements in the same document.

In my experience, woring in scribus with RGB and then exporting from PDF version 1.4 and choosing "printer" as output produces a solid PDF that every print shop will accept without questions. 

The upcoming versions of Scribus will allow PDF/X, which is a variant of PDF specially taylored for printing, but meanwhile the settings offered above are fine.

Just keep in mind to set the right color profiles in the color management section of the preferences so the conversions are properly managed, according to the colorspace provided by your print supplier.

TL;DR: Use Scribus, export PDF 1.4, choose "printer" as output and don't convert stuff to CMYK, Scribus will do it for anything that is not in the printer colorspace already.

BTW, since this is the GIMP mailing list, keep in mind that you can produce files for print from GIMP, but you can't produce a CMYK PDF. You can, however, produce a CMYK TIFF file with GIMP and the Separate+ Plugin that should be acceptable f

Gez.