Is there any way to change the format that's the default save. I don't use .xcf and prefer to use png or jpg. Why do I have to export them instead of simply save? Why did they change it in this version? It's annoying.

This matter has been thrashed to death several times over the last couple of years.

When I saw your message I thought you were a troll wanting to kick the matter off again, but maybe you are sincere.

1. There will be no change to the "save" system.

2. Get used to it or move on.

And maybe read the archives of the list for somewhere between one and two million other messages on this matter.

Owen

From: pat.mysterywriter@gmail.com Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2013 02:40:23 -0400 To: gimp-user-list@gnome.org
Subject: [Gimp-user] Change the default Save extension

Is there any way to change the format that's the default save. I don't use .xcf and prefer to use png or jpg. Why do I have to export them instead of simply save? Why did they change it in this version? It's annoying.

Pat Brown

http://pabrown.com/ It is perfectly okay to write garbage--as long as you edit brilliantly - C. J. Cherryh
_______________________________________________ gimp-user-list mailing list
gimp-user-list@gnome.org
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user-list

The reason is because a lot of other people use GIMP to work on complicated digital art which requires keeping a file containing multiple layers, and some of those people lost valuable project time and effort by saving to the wrong file format before quitting GIMP. (It's not the 'saving' part that was necessarily the problem, but the 'quitting' part).

I agree the change may be difficult to get used to and it possibly was not implemented or handled as well as it could be, but the new behavior is also a standard design paradigm so for now your choices really do boil down to adjusting to the new behavior or moving on to something else (I hear there's an alternate GIMP fork which restores the old behavior).

-- Stratadrake strata_ranger@hotmail.com
--------------------
Numbers may not lie, but neither do they tell the whole truth.

=

On 04/23/2013 05:59 PM, Richard Gitschlag wrote:

From: pat.mysterywriter@gmail.com

> Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2013 02:40:23 -0400 > To: gimp-user-list@gnome.org
> Subject: [Gimp-user] Change the default Save extension >
> Is there any way to change the format that's the default save. I don't > use .xcf and prefer to use png or jpg. Why do I have to export them > instead of simply save? Why did they change it in this version? It's > annoying.
>
> Pat Brown
>
> http://pabrown.com/
> It is perfectly okay to write garbage--as long as you edit brilliantly > - C. J. Cherryh
> _______________________________________________ > gimp-user-list mailing list
> gimp-user-list@gnome.org
> https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user-list

The reason is because a lot of other people use GIMP to work on complicated digital art which requires keeping a file containing multiple layers, and some of those people lost valuable project time and effort by saving to the wrong file format before quitting GIMP. (It's not the 'saving' part that was necessarily the problem, but the 'quitting' part).

I agree the change may be difficult to get used to and it possibly was not implemented or handled as well as it could be, but the new behavior is also a standard design paradigm so for now your choices really do boil down to adjusting to the new behavior or moving on to something else (I hear there's an alternate GIMP fork which restores the old behavior).

Hi
Lot of people don't "use GIMP to work on complicated digital art". Example : my wife is a teacher, and like most teachers, she just need to resize, change tone, etc... .png or .jpeg pictures, never .xcf. This behavior is annoying because many people think that gimp is unusable and therefore install photoshop. This is not a good advertisement for the free software. There's no alternate GIMP fork which restores the normal behavior. I'm getting tired of seeing the word "troll" whenever someone criticizes Gimp
Greetings

Maderios
"Art is meant to disturb. Science reassures."
"L'art est fait pour troubler. La science rassure" (Georges Braque)

On 4/25/2013 2:03 PM, maderios wrote:

On 04/23/2013 05:59 PM, Richard Gitschlag wrote:

From: pat.mysterywriter@gmail.com

> Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2013 02:40:23 -0400 > To: gimp-user-list@gnome.org
> Subject: [Gimp-user] Change the default Save extension >
> Is there any way to change the format that's the default save. I don't
> use .xcf and prefer to use png or jpg. Why do I have to export them > instead of simply save? Why did they change it in this version? It's > annoying.
>
> Pat Brown
>
> http://pabrown.com/
> It is perfectly okay to write garbage--as long as you edit brilliantly
> - C. J. Cherryh
> _______________________________________________ > gimp-user-list mailing list
> gimp-user-list@gnome.org
> https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user-list

The reason is because a lot of other people use GIMP to work on complicated digital art which requires keeping a file containing multiple layers, and some of those people lost valuable project time and effort by saving to the wrong file format before quitting GIMP. (It's not the 'saving' part that was necessarily the problem, but the 'quitting' part).

I agree the change may be difficult to get used to and it possibly was not implemented or handled as well as it could be, but the new behavior is also a standard design paradigm so for now your choices really do boil down to adjusting to the new behavior or moving on to something else (I hear there's an alternate GIMP fork which restores the old behavior).

Hi
Lot of people don't "use GIMP to work on complicated digital art". Example : my wife is a teacher, and like most teachers, she just need to resize, change tone, etc... .png or .jpeg pictures, never .xcf. This behavior is annoying because many people think that gimp is unusable and therefore install photoshop. This is not a good advertisement for the free software. There's no alternate GIMP fork which restores the normal behavior. I'm getting tired of seeing the word "troll" whenever someone criticizes Gimp
Greetings

Criticize all you want but be aware that you will get one of two responses (a) all those people who agree with you and have been making the same criticism for quite a while, or (b) Sorry you feel that way but get used to it.

The default save for photoshop is .psd You have to do a "save as" or "save for web" to get .png
it took a while to get used to "export to" rather than "save as" but it is no extra work.
If all you want to do is resize, do basic color changes, etc. There are so many ways to do this outside the gimp or photoshop that I won't even bother enumerating. So don't use gimp, don't use a pirated version of photoshop (if you've already paid hundreds of dollars for a piece of software, why even think of using the gimp?). Anyone who thinks that photoshop is easier to use is not likely to be influenced by the best of any advertising.

===============================================================
Life is not a problem to be solved, a question to be answered.  
Life is a mystery to be contemplated, wondered at, and savored.
     --- A. DeMello S.J.

http://home.gwi.net/~mdmpsyd/index.htm

On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:03 PM, maderios wrote:

I'm getting tired of seeing the word "troll" whenever someone criticizes Gimp

Making deliberately incorrect statements like

There's no alternate GIMP fork which restores the normal behavior.

qualifies as trolling.

https://github.com/mskala/noxcf-gimp

Alexandre Prokoudine http://libregraphicsworld.org

On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 2:44 PM, Alexandre Prokoudine < alexandre.prokoudine@gmail.com> wrote:

On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:03 PM, maderios wrote:

I'm getting tired of seeing the word "troll" whenever someone criticizes Gimp

Making deliberately incorrect statements like

There's no alternate GIMP fork which restores the normal behavior.

qualifies as trolling.

https://github.com/mskala/noxcf-gimp

Being misinformed does *not* qualify as trolling. The way Owen came out of the gate swinging is what I would consider trolling (stirring up a fuss). I wasn't even involved in the discussion until now and I got pissed when I read his comments. I think the list can do better than that. I don't want our list to end up like the Linux kernel ML where if strict rules aren't followed newcomers are harassed to no end. It's very counter productive and a lot of times why I categorically leave communities. You'll find it is much harder to expand your developer base if you act immature like that. Have some patience.

SAM

On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:59 PM, Sam Gleske wrote:

Making deliberately incorrect statements like

There's no alternate GIMP fork which restores the normal behavior.

qualifies as trolling.

https://github.com/mskala/noxcf-gimp

Being misinformed does *not* qualify as trolling.

https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-user-list/2012-September/msg00087.html https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-user-list/2012-November/msg00205.html

As you can see the fork has been pointed out to maderios on a few occasions.

Would you like to reconsider your opinion?

I think the list can do better than that. I don't want our list to end up like the Linux kernel ML where if strict rules aren't followed newcomers are harassed to no end. It's very counter productive and a lot of times why I categorically leave communities. You'll find it is much harder to expand your developer base if you act immature like that. Have some patience.

I've a bottomless supply of patience. Would you like some? :)

Alexandre Prokoudine http://libregraphicsworld.org

Owens answer basically says it all. Pats question might have been serious, but this topic was discussed over and over again. Let's leave it at that.

Kind regards,

Sven

On 04/25/2013 08:59 PM, Sam Gleske wrote:

Being misinformed does *not* qualify as trolling. The way Owen came out of the gate swinging is what I would consider trolling (stirring up a fuss). I wasn't even involved in the discussion until now and I got pissed when I read his comments. I think the list can do better than that. I don't want our list to end up like the Linux kernel ML where if strict rules aren't followed newcomers are harassed to no end. It's very counter productive and a lot of times why I categorically leave communities. You'll find it is much harder to expand your developer base if you act immature like that. Have some patience.

Hi
You can try to compare Gimp list with other lists like Digikam or E17. It's very different...
Developers listen to users because they do not know all the needs of users and they want to improve the software. Furthermore, these developers try sometimes to explain their approach, which allows to build relationships. This is beneficial to advance the project. Ask yourself why most users still sulking Gimp... Greetings

Maderios
"Art is meant to disturb. Science reassures."
"L'art est fait pour troubler. La science rassure" (Georges Braque)

* Sam Gleske [04-25-13 15:01]:
[...]

Being misinformed does *not* qualify as trolling. The way Owen came out of the gate swinging is what I would consider trolling (stirring up a fuss). I wasn't even involved in the discussion until now and I got pissed when I read his comments. I think the list can do better than that. I don't want our list to end up like the Linux kernel ML where if strict rules aren't followed newcomers are harassed to no end. It's very counter productive and a lot of times why I categorically leave communities. You'll find it is much harder to expand your developer base if you act immature like that. Have some patience.

Immaturity you manifest by posting html for no *good* reason? Getting pissed?

Grow up!

(paka)Patrick Shanahan       Plainfield, Indiana, USA      HOG # US1244711
http://wahoo.no-ip.org        Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2
http://en.opensuse.org                           openSUSE Community Member
Registered Linux User #207535                    @ http://linuxcounter.net

On Fri, Apr 26, 2013 at 12:20 AM, maderios wrote:

Ask yourself why most users still sulking Gimp...

Last time I checked you weren't selected by the majority of users to express their point of view. Impersonation is hardly a convincing approach.

We've listened to your opinion and we respectfully disagree. The matter ends there.

Your further attempts to disrupt the easy-going atmosphere in the community are likely to cause some administrative action.

Alexandre Prokoudine http://libregraphicsworld.org

On 04/26/2013 08:13 AM, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote:

On Fri, Apr 26, 2013 at 12:20 AM, maderios wrote:

Ask yourself why most users still sulking Gimp...

Last time I checked you weren't selected by the majority of users to express their point of view. Impersonation is hardly a convincing approach.

We've listened to your opinion and we respectfully disagree. The matter ends there.

Your further attempts to disrupt the easy-going atmosphere in the community are likely to cause some administrative action.

Hi Alexandre
Democracy provides an opportunity to criticize, to improve everything. Don't be afraid with democracy...
http://blogs.fsfe.org/hugo/2009/11/free-software-free-society-of-democracy-and-hacking-draft-1/

Maderios
"Art is meant to disturb. Science reassures."
"L'art est fait pour troubler. La science rassure" (Georges Braque)

maderios (maderios@gmail.com) wrote:

Democracy provides an opportunity to criticize, to improve everything. Don't be afraid with democracy...

Note that neither the GIMP project nor the mailinglists are organized in a democratic manner. We are by no means obliged to let everyone discrupt the communication on our mailinglists.

You're welcome to fork GIMP as often as you like and implement whatever save behaviour you want. That is the kind of democracy the blog entry talks about (although I am unsure if it is the correct term to use).

And you're of course welcome to repeat your criticism as often as you like on your personal homepage and we won't try to interfere with you there.

Bye,
Simon

simon@budig.de              http://simon.budig.de/

You've gone past criticism, Maderios, to harassment.

On 4/26/2013 11:13 AM, maderios wrote:

On 04/26/2013 08:13 AM, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote:

On Fri, Apr 26, 2013 at 12:20 AM, maderios wrote:

Ask yourself why most users still sulking Gimp...

Last time I checked you weren't selected by the majority of users to express their point of view. Impersonation is hardly a convincing approach.

We've listened to your opinion and we respectfully disagree. The matter ends there.

Your further attempts to disrupt the easy-going atmosphere in the community are likely to cause some administrative action.

Hi Alexandre
Democracy provides an opportunity to criticize, to improve everything. Don't be afraid with democracy...
http://blogs.fsfe.org/hugo/2009/11/free-software-free-society-of-democracy-and-hacking-draft-1/