On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 2:02 AM, erroneus wrote:

Why would developers choose to shut us out like this?

We don't do any Linux packaging. We encourage you to become the first team member who does it.

Alexandre Prokoudine http://libregraphicsworld.org

I've been looking all over but there are just no CentOS (or RHEL for that matter) packages for the latest version of GiMP. Compiling from source doesn't even seem to be a good option either as it looks as if it will break the whole OS the way things are set up.

This is no way to build an application! Applications and OSes should never be tied so closely together.

I like GiMP 2.8 for Windows a lot and would prefer to run it under CentOS as that is my main desktop OS. I have given up on Fedora because of the unholy abomination GNOME has become.

Packaging is not a developers problem, talk to the CentOS people?

I have a KDE version of Fedora 17, 2.8 came with that.

Also have Gnome and XFCE versions of Fedora 17, prefer the KDE.

Hello erroneus,

On Sat, 14 Jul 2012 00:02:29 +0200 erroneus wrote:

I've been looking all over but there are just no CentOS (or RHEL for that matter) packages for the latest version of GiMP. Compiling from source doesn't even seem to be a good option either as it looks as if it will break the whole OS the way things are set up.

Why would it? Just compile using "./configure --prefix=/opt/gimp-2.8.x" (for example) and install under a separate prefix. No need to install directly under /usr .

Hope it helps.

Regards,

Shlomi Fish

This is no way to build an application! Applications and OSes should never be tied so closely together.

I like GiMP 2.8 for Windows a lot and would prefer to run it under CentOS as that is my main desktop OS. I have given up on Fedora because of the unholy abomination GNOME has become.

What is a CentOS user to do? We want a stable and consistent OS and user experience without having to reload/update everything after less than a year, and if I want to run a current version of Libre Office, there is no trouble. I can do that. If I want a current version of Firefox, I can do that. But GiMP? Nope!

Why would developers choose to shut us out like this?

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Hello erroneus,

On Sat, 14 Jul 2012 00:02:29 +0200 erroneus wrote:

I've been looking all over but there are just no CentOS (or RHEL for that matter) packages for the latest version of GiMP. Compiling from source doesn't even seem to be a good option either as it looks as if it will break the whole OS the way things are set up.

Why would it? Just compile using "./configure --prefix=/opt/gimp-2.8.x" (for example) and install under a separate prefix. No need to install directly under /usr .

Hope it helps.

Regards,

Shlomi Fish

This is no way to build an application! Applications and OSes should never be tied so closely together.

I like GiMP 2.8 for Windows a lot and would prefer to run it under CentOS as that is my main desktop OS. I have given up on Fedora because of the unholy abomination GNOME has become.

What is a CentOS user to do? We want a stable and consistent OS and user experience without having to reload/update everything after less than a year, and if I want to run a current version of Libre Office, there is no trouble. I can do that. If I want a current version of Firefox, I can do that. But GiMP? Nope!

Why would developers choose to shut us out like this?

I checked Distrowatch for Centos:Ridiculous,Their Gimp is at 2.6.9 while the last in the 2,6 series is 2,6.12.
I've been using Gentoo since december 2003 after trying a lot of distro's. Go to their website and check out the Handbook. It has a steep learning curve but the reward is commensurate. You'll be able to install and compile anything you may want. Gerard.

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Hello gerard82,

On Sat, 14 Jul 2012 11:59:22 +0200 gerard82 wrote:

This is no way to build an application! Applications and OSes should never be tied so closely together.

I like GiMP 2.8 for Windows a lot and would prefer to run it under CentOS as that is my main desktop OS. I have given up on Fedora because of the unholy abomination GNOME has become.

What is a CentOS user to do? We want a stable and consistent OS and user experience without having to reload/update everything after less than a year, and if I want to run a current version of Libre Office, there is no trouble. I can do that. If I want a current version of Firefox, I can do that. But GiMP? Nope!

Why would developers choose to shut us out like this?

I checked Distrowatch for Centos:Ridiculous,Their Gimp is at 2.6.9 while the last in the 2,6 series is 2,6.12.
I've been using Gentoo since december 2003 after trying a lot of distro's. Go to their website and check out the Handbook. It has a steep learning curve but the reward is commensurate. You'll be able to install and compile anything you may want. Gerard.

There are many distributions one can recommend instead of CentOS (and I have my own preference that is not Gentoo) and I'm sure a lot of them have many merits, but the question was asked regarding CentOS and we should stick to providing advice for it. See:

http://www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/computers/web/use-qmail-instead/

Regards,

Shlomi Fish

P.S: Gentoo is for wimps. Real men use Linux From Scratch! And real programmers use butterflies:

http://xkcd.com/378/

;-)

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isn’t a good reason for it.

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On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 6:39 PM, erroneus wrote:

But it has revealed what I believe are philisophical flaws in GiMP and/or GNOME which I think should be resolved.

You mean that GIMP developers sometimes bump dependencies? We don't do it, because we like annoying people. We do it, because upstream system libraries get important fixes.

You may see it as a philosophical flow, but I see it as just another example of duality.

How do I get this shared with developers?

You already have.

Alexandre Prokoudine http://libregraphicsworld.org

On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 6:39 PM, erroneus wrote:

I want to be able to run my older version of GNOME with a newer version of GiMP. How can I resolve this? If the answer is compiling from source, can I get some hints as to what whole sets of source I need to get and how to go about installing them? I suspect it's all about the command line switches saying something like "install everything in /usr/local/gimp-2.8.0" or something to that effect.

I suggest you read these instructions (ignore the ubuntu bias);

http://www.gimpusers.com/tutorials/compiling-gimp-for-ubuntu

If that's a whole new world, you will find it an interesting learning curve

On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 8:18 PM, erroneus wrote:

I suggest you read these instructions (ignore the ubuntu bias);

http://www.gimpusers.com/tutorials/compiling-gimp-for-ubuntu

If that's a whole new world, you will find it an interesting learning curve

It's not a "whole new" world, but it's not something I've done in a long while. I would love it if someone were to explain what everything there does and why they are doing it like that.

When I went to compile the things myself, I kept getting "gegl" and/or "bebl" versions not correct even though I had just compiled those libraries as the newest. It keeps identifying the other versions I have installed instead. (Would it be best to uninstall those? I suppose I should try)

It's nice to have "here's what you do" but when accompanied with what it means and why, then you have real learning.

I think CentOS uses gtk+ 2.x. So you shouldn't have to mess with system files.

Suppose you want to build and install Gimp 2.8 in $HOME/opt.

So that we don't mess with system libraries ( seems like you have gegl/babl installed already), we will ask Gimp to look somewhere else.

Export PKG_CONFIG_PATH=/opt/gimp-2.8/lib/pkgconfig:$PKG_CONFIG_PATH Now make babl (which has minimal dependencies. Something like:

cd babl ./configure --prefix=$HOME/opt/gimp-2.8 make; make install

cd gegl
./configure --prefix=$HOME/opt/gimp-2.8 --disable-docs make; make install

cd gimp
./configure --prefix=$HOME/opt/gimp-2.8 make; make install

Now you should have gimp 2.8 installed in $HOME/opt/gimp-2.8

To run gimp, simply do: $HOME/opt/gimp-2.8/bin/gimp

and you should be good to go.

Hope that helps.

http://www.gimpusers.com/tutorials/compiling-gimp-for-ubuntu

Just so you know... I just removed the BABL and GEGL libraries from my system and attempted to build exactly as the instructions say I should... well, it says:

checking for GLIB - version >= 2.28.0... no *** Could not run GLIB test program, checking why... *** The test program failed to compile or link. See the file config.log for the
*** exact error that occured. This usually means GLIB is incorrectly installed.
configure: error:
*** GLIB 2.28.0 or better is required. The latest version of *** GLIB is always available from ftp://ftp.gtk.org/.

I think I will give this a try after dinner... the wife' "strongly hinting" that I should eat. I wonder if I will be able to build a conflicting version of GLIB in the /opt/gimp-2.8 tree without other issues.

You need to build things in the selected build directory, babl, gegl and gimp

If glib and gtk versions are too low, you need to build those and their dependancies in the selected directory.

DO NOT BUILD IN /usr or /usr/local

Make sure that the console you are working is the console that you have exported the paths as per the gimp users tutorial. That way, looking for libraries ensures the first searched path is your build directory, not /usr or /usr/local

You need to build things in the selected build directory, babl, gegl and gimp

If glib and gtk versions are too low, you need to build those and their dependancies in the selected directory.

DO NOT BUILD IN /usr or /usr/local

Make sure that the console you are working is the console that you have exported the paths as per the gimp users tutorial. That way, looking for libraries ensures the first searched path is your build directory, not /usr or /usr/local

Got it... I'm currently wallowing in dependency hell. Each thing needs another thing... so far I have downloaded the following: cairo, pango, gdk-pixbuf, gtk+, atk, libffi and glib along with the previous babl and gegl and now it's telling me I will need poppler and pixman as well. The rabbit hole goes deeper and deeper and the passages ever winding.

I just want to make graphics... you know? This stuff is making me tired and my eyes dry.

That's why you should opt for a general usage distro. Fedora, SUSE, Ubuntu, and probably the best IMHO, is Mint.

If you want to play with Centos and other boutique distros, be prepared to do the hard yards.

On Sun, 2012-07-15 at 19:07 +0200, erroneus wrote:

CentOS/RHEL is not a boutique distro any more than Debian is. I have been a Fedora user since the distro began but when they went with GNOME 3, I just couldn't stand it any longer. I wanted stable and unchanging with long term support. Ubuntu TLS distros... are they also boutique? By "boutique" I presume you mean "small and specialized." CentOS (rebranded RHEL) is far from fitting that definition. (yeah, I am a little offended but I'll get over it.)

I have had some measure of success but not before running into countless issues with compiling and configuring. Among the ones that stick with me is the lack of SVG support. I have librsvg and librsvg-devel installed as well as compiled libraries I have installed from source to /opt/gimp-2.8. The gimp compile process still does not detect librsvg. Here is the summary after running ./configure:

Extra Binaries: gimp-console: yes

Optional Features: D-Bus service: yes
Language selection: yes

Optional Plug-Ins: Ascii Art: no (AA library not found) Compressor: yes
Ghostscript: yes
Help Browser: no (WebKit not found) LCMS: yes
JPEG: yes
JPEG 2000: yes
MNG: yes
PDF (import): Using PostScript plug-in (libpoppler not found) PDF (export): yes
PNG: yes
Print: yes
PSP: yes
Python: yes
Script-Fu: yes
SVG: no (librsvg not found) TIFF: yes
TWAIN (MacOS X): no
TWAIN (Win32): no
URI: yes (using GIO/GVfs) Webpage: no (WebKit not found) Windows ICO: yes
WMF: yes
XJT: yes
X11 Mouse Cursor: yes
XPM: yes

Plug-In Features: EXIF support: yes

Optional Modules: ALSA (MIDI Input): yes
Linux Input: yes (GUdev support: no (libgudev not found)) DirectInput (Win32): no
Color Correction: yes
Soft Proof: yes

Tests: Use xvfb-run no (not found)

It is also of interesting note that I have also attempted to resolve the poppler library lack without success. I just don't know what is missing from all of this.

I used 'librsvg-2.36.1.tar.xz' when compiling 2.8 and everything went fine...
Give it a try to that version of librsvg, remember setting: export PATH=$PATH:/opt/gimp-2.8/bin
export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/opt/gimp-2.8/lib export PKG_CONFIG_PATH=/opt/gimp-2.8/lib/pkgconfig

and: configure --prefix=/opt/gimp-2.8
make -j 2
make install

this 'make install' with elevated privileges according with the permissions of '/opt/gimp-2.8'
then try 'configure --prefix=/opt/gimp-2.8' again in GIMP source code folder.

Good Luck!
Aliet Expósito

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On Sun, 2012-07-15 at 19:07 +0200, erroneus wrote:

It is also of interesting note that I have also attempted to resolve the poppler library lack without success. I just don't know what is missing from all of this.

As of poppler, GIMP requires 'poppler-glib >= 0.12.4' I used the packages in my repository: libpoppler-dev
libpoppler-glib-dev

both of them version '0.12.4' try those packages and if any error occurs, please report them back... Luck!
Aliet Exposito

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On Sun, 2012-07-15 at 21:38 +0200, erroneus wrote:

I used 'librsvg-2.36.1.tar.xz' when compiling 2.8 and everything went fine...
Give it a try to that version of librsvg, remember setting: export PATH=$PATH:/opt/gimp-2.8/bin
export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/opt/gimp-2.8/lib export PKG_CONFIG_PATH=/opt/gimp-2.8/lib/pkgconfig

and:
configure --prefix=/opt/gimp-2.8
make -j 2
make install

this 'make install' with elevated privileges according with the permissions of '/opt/gimp-2.8'
then try 'configure --prefix=/opt/gimp-2.8' again in GIMP source code folder.

Yes, these are all the things I am doing. When I get to the:

./configure --prefix=/opt/gimp-2.8

It fails with:

checking for gobject-introspection... configure: error: gobject-introspection-1.0 is not installed

I, of course, have been trying to install gobject-instrospection and have been failing miserably. Sourcing various versions from here: http://ftp.acc.umu.se/pub/GNOME/sources/ I have tried many versions all with the same failure talking about Glib-2.0.gir.. and it seems to be looking somewhere other than /opt/gimp-2.8 for it.

The previous two threads didn't go to the list, clicked 'Reply' instead 'Reply to All' so they went directly to your mail, my mistake... :P

Try configuring 'librsvg' without 'gobject-introspection': ./configure --prefix=/opt/gimp-2.8/ --enable-introspection=no

And yes, I tried compiling 'gobject-introspection-1.33.3.tar.xz' and 'librsvg-2.36.1' fails to detect it, so for now disable it and give it a try.

Aliet

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The previous two threads didn't go to the list, clicked 'Reply' instead
'Reply to All' so they went directly to your mail, my mistake... :P

Try configuring 'librsvg' without 'gobject-introspection': ./configure --prefix=/opt/gimp-2.8/ --enable-introspection=no

And yes, I tried compiling 'gobject-introspection-1.33.3.tar.xz' and 'librsvg-2.36.1' fails to detect it, so for now disable it and give it a
try.

Okay, we have success with svg image loading.

One last thing and it's probably trivial for everyone here but me. The GTK themes aren't taking. When run from the command line, I get this:

(gimp:26437): Gtk-WARNING **: Unable to locate theme engine in module_path: "clearlooks",
Gtk-Message: Failed to load module "pk-gtk-module" Gtk-Message: Failed to load module "canberra-gtk-module"

What do I need to do to resolve that? It's usable, but it doesn't use the colors and stuff that other windows use.

Does CentOS use yum?

What does # yum search canberra or
# yum search clearlooks

output?

On 07/15/2012 06:40 PM, Owen wrote:

Does CentOS use yum? What does # yum search canberra or # yum search clearlooks output?

======================================================== Matched: canberra ========================================================= libcanberra-gtk2.i686 : Gtk+ Bindings for libcanberra libcanberra-gtk2.x86_64 : Gtk+ Bindings for libcanberra libcanberra-devel.i686 : Development Files for libcanberra Client Development
libcanberra-devel.x86_64 : Development Files for libcanberra Client Development
libcanberra.i686 : Portable Sound Event Library libcanberra.x86_64 : Portable Sound Event Library

======================================================= Matched: clearlooks ======================================================== icewm-clearlooks.noarch : Clearlooks like theme for IceWM

I usually do this:

[daniel@alpha ~]$ yum list | grep -i canberra libcanberra.x86_64 0.22-1.el6.centos @anaconda-CentOS-201112091719.x86_64/6.2 libcanberra-gtk2.x86_64 0.22-1.el6.centos @anaconda-CentOS-201112091719.x86_64/6.2 libcanberra.i686 0.22-1.el6.centos base libcanberra-devel.i686 0.22-1.el6.centos base libcanberra-devel.x86_64 0.22-1.el6.centos base libcanberra-gtk2.i686 0.22-1.el6.centos base [daniel@alpha ~]$ yum list | grep -i clearlooks icewm-clearlooks.noarch 1.3.7-3.el6 epel

The @ in the 3rd column indicates it's installed. Clearlooks seems to be coming from my home directory... I think...

But since I installed everything in /opt/gimp-2.8, should I also need to put canberra in there as well? I have a boat-load of conflicting libraries in there... (Sure would be nice to be able to package ALL of that stuff into a single RPM and just call it "gimp-2.8.0-0-retrofit.x86_64.rpm")

On Mon, 2012-07-16 at 12:56 +0200, erroneus wrote:

I also have poppler-glib 0.12.4 which comes with my distro. However, the compiler doesn't see it. It's not the show-stopper that the SVG support was.

You need the development packages, those two: libpoppler-dev
libpoppler-glib-dev

'libpoppler-dev' is a dependency of 'libpoppler-glib-dev' so you need both of them, I imagine your distro separates the devel packages from the standard libraries hence the *-dev in the names.

Aliet Exposito

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On Sun, 2012-07-15 at 04:14 +0200, erroneus wrote:

You need to build things in the selected build directory, babl, gegl and gimp

If glib and gtk versions are too low, you need to build those and their dependancies in the selected directory.

DO NOT BUILD IN /usr or /usr/local

Just a note here, there are rpm packages fo gimp 2.8 for Centos 6.2 and 6.3 according to rpmfind.net.

It's probably also fine to build in /usr/local, it is on most rpm-based systes - as far as I can tell it's only debian and debian-like systems that consider /usr/local to be part of the operating system.

But good advice to stay away from it in general, though.

Liam

On Sun, 2012-07-15 at 04:14 +0200, erroneus wrote:

You need to build things in the selected build directory, babl, gegl and gimp

If glib and gtk versions are too low, you need to build those and their dependancies in the selected directory.

DO NOT BUILD IN /usr or /usr/local

Just a note here, there are rpm packages fo gimp 2.8 for Centos 6.2 and 6.3 according to rpmfind.net.

It's probably also fine to build in /usr/local, it is on most rpm-based systes - as far as I can tell it's only debian and debian-like systems that consider /usr/local to be part of the operating system.

But good advice to stay away from it in general, though.

Liam

Liam Quin - XML Activity Lead, W3C, http://www.w3.org/People/Quin/
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