--- Sab 29/10/11, Johan Vromans wrote:

Any ideas how this will impact
foto-editing?

www.lytro.com

It could impact much more than editing. E.g., autofocus would become useless.

However they still have to convince me that their idea has roots in reality and in physic laws, and specifying their imaging sensor in terms of a precise number of "light rays" captured, as they do, does not help in this respect.

--Stefano

They've already announced that initial resulting pictures would be "about HD quality" (ie 1920x1080 or so) from the 11 "megarays" sensor. So editing these images in Gimp should be no problem whatsoever.

It's worth pointing out that consumer-level digital cameras started off with way less resolution than that. New tech needs time to develop. The concept is promising, but if the big companies want nothing to do with it, then it'll just disappear.

Please note, this has absolutely nothing to do with using Gimp. I've tried to add some Gimp relevance in my first paragraph, but it's a stretch. There are far better discussion forums available for these types of subjects.

--
Frank Gore
www.ProjectPontiac.com

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 1:12 PM, Stefano Rovetta wrote:

--- Sab 29/10/11, Johan Vromans wrote:

Any ideas how this will impact
foto-editing?

www.lytro.com

It could impact much more than editing. E.g., autofocus would become useless.

However they still have to convince me that their idea has roots in reality and in physic laws, and specifying their imaging sensor in terms of a precise number of "light rays" captured, as they do, does not help in this respect.

--Stefano _______________________________________________ gimp-user-list mailing list
gimp-user-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user-list

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 1:47 PM, Johan Vromans wrote:

But what would be required to process the 'raw' (multi-dimensional) data from an LFE camera? Each pixel or group of pixels gets a Z-component that makes the object that this group represents in focus in a particular plane only.

It currently requires custom proprietary software from the manufacturer, no other software can decode those images yet. As for the mechanics of how it could be done and how to add support for it, that would be best discussed on the dev mailing list. However, since there are currently no publicly available output files from those cameras, the point is moot.

-- Frank Gore
THE place to talk photography!
www.FriendlyPhotoZone.com

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 1:47 PM, Johan Vromans wrote:

But what would be required to process the 'raw' (multi-dimensional) data from an LFE camera? Each pixel or group of pixels gets a Z-component that makes the object that this group represents in focus in a particular plane only.

It currently requires custom proprietary software from the manufacturer, no other software can decode those images yet. As for the mechanics of how it could be done and how to add support for it, that would be best discussed on the dev mailing list. However, since there are currently no publicly available output files from those cameras, the point is moot.

-- Frank Gore
www.ProjectPontiac.com

On Sat, 29 Oct 2011 13:35:06 -0400 Frank Gore wrote:

They've already announced that initial resulting pictures would be "about HD quality" (ie 1920x1080 or so) from the 11 "megarays" sensor. So editing these images in Gimp should be no problem whatsoever.

A minor point, but when a message is addressed to both the list and to an individual it helps the rest of us if the list is the addressee and the individual is the cc. That way we can sort messages into folders based on the "To" field.

My incoming messages are sorted into 50 folders, for mailing lists, individual customers and the like.

On 10/29/2011 10:54 AM, Frank Gore wrote:

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 1:47 PM, Johan Vromans wrote:

But what would be required to process the 'raw' (multi-dimensional) data from an LFE camera? Each pixel or group of pixels gets a Z-component that makes the object that this group represents in focus in a particular plane only.

It currently requires custom proprietary software from the manufacturer, no other software can decode those images yet. As for the mechanics of how it could be done and how to add support for it, that would be best discussed on the dev mailing list. However, since there are currently no publicly available output files from those cameras, the point is moot.

-- Frank Gore
www.ProjectPontiac.com
_______________________________________________ gimp-user-list mailing list
gimp-user-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user-list

It appears (from the underlying thesis) that an array of individual images with different
focuses are captured. The thesis itself indicates 30 images located in a square array,
with the target image captured in each element. Since the images are distributed across
the entire photosensitive array, a fair amount of chromatic dispersion can be detected.

For any image, therefore, 30 times as many pixels (more or less, depending on the subsequent manufacturing details) must be captured. The underlying software has an apparently complex but straightforward sorting problem, allowing to choose whichever pixel is at the best focus for the selected image point in the composite.

It appears at first glance that the images in the light field camera picture gallery have
at least four focal planes available (https://www.lytro.com/living-pictures/282).

From the image editing standpoint (if this is the case), it would not be sharply different
from the refocusing opportunity by providing four successive shots with different focal
length. Of course, the chromatic aberration correction would not be available this way,
nor would moving image capture be handled.

So the thirty images would necessarily have to be divided into the appropriate planes,
presumably using radial symmetry for the chromatic correction.

Seems to me the light field camera is a pretty good idea, and as it evolves over time I
suspect it will be quite interesting.

The thesis itself is available from the lytro.com website - lytro.com/renng-thesis.pdf

-- Burnie

Hell John,

On Sat, 29 Oct 2011 16:03:52 -0400 john Culleton wrote:

On Sat, 29 Oct 2011 13:35:06 -0400 Frank Gore wrote:

They've already announced that initial resulting pictures would be "about HD quality" (ie 1920x1080 or so) from the 11 "megarays" sensor. So editing these images in Gimp should be no problem whatsoever.

A minor point, but when a message is addressed to both the list and to an individual it helps the rest of us if the list is the addressee and the individual is the cc. That way we can sort messages into folders based on the "To" field.

That's a non-reliable way to sort messages from mailing lists (as your message indicates). A better way would be to filter based on the headers of List-Id: / List-Post: / etc. which mailing list managers add. Many mailers such as KMail, Claws-Mail and GMail.com support filtering based on that.

Regards,

Shlomi Fish

My incoming messages are sorted into 50 folders, for mailing lists, individual customers and the like.

On 10/29/2011 04:15 PM, Burnie West wrote:

On 10/29/2011 10:54 AM, Frank Gore wrote:

On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 1:47 PM, Johan Vromans wrote:

But what would be required to process the 'raw' (multi-dimensional) data from an LFE camera? Each pixel or group of pixels gets a Z-component that makes the object that this group represents in focus in a particular plane only.

It currently requires custom proprietary software from the manufacturer, no other software can decode those images yet. As for the mechanics of how it could be done and how to add support for it, that would be best discussed on the dev mailing list. However, since there are currently no publicly available output files from those cameras, the point is moot.

-- Frank Gore
www.ProjectPontiac.com
_______________________________________________ gimp-user-list mailing list
gimp-user-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user-list

It appears (from the underlying thesis) that an array of individual images with different
focuses are captured. The thesis itself indicates 30 images located in a square array,
with the target image captured in each element. Since the images are distributed across
the entire photosensitive array, a fair amount of chromatic dispersion can be detected.

For any image, therefore, 30 times as many pixels (more or less, depending on the subsequent manufacturing details) must be captured. The underlying software has an
apparently complex but straightforward sorting problem, allowing to choose whichever
pixel is at the best focus for the selected image point in the composite.

It appears at first glance that the images in the light field camera picture gallery have
at least four focal planes available (https://www.lytro.com/living-pictures/282).

From the image editing standpoint (if this is the case), it would not be sharply different
from the refocusing opportunity by providing four successive shots with different focal
length. Of course, the chromatic aberration correction would not be available this way,
nor would moving image capture be handled.

So the thirty images would necessarily have to be divided into the appropriate planes,
presumably using radial symmetry for the chromatic correction.

Seems to me the light field camera is a pretty good idea, and as it evolves over time I
suspect it will be quite interesting.

The thesis itself is available from the lytro.com website - lytro.com/renng-thesis.pdf

-- Burnie _______________________________________________ gimp-user-list mailing list
gimp-user-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user-list

An article in the December Atlantic magazine ("Deep Focus" by Rob Walker) suggests that the released Lytro cameras are more complex than the aforementioned thesis describes. According to Rob, Ren Ng's Lytro camera has "integrated hundreds of microlenses into a single device." Certainly interesting; hardly a simple direction for GIMP to pursue.

-- Burnie

On 2011-10-29 17:01, Johan Vromans wrote: > Any ideas how this will impact foto-editing?

From GIMP's perspective, I think this can be seen as a new, more advanced, form av RAW images.

Current RAW images allows you to adjust certain aspectes after the exposure, such as white balance. This Light Field Camera adds another aspect to the list of adjustable aspectes: focus.

Currently GIMP has no direct support for any RAW images, you have to pre-process them with a plugin which generates a regular bitmap which is then fed into GIMP. Images from a Ligth Field Camera could be handled in the same way.

On 11/13/2011 02:42 AM, Mikael St