I would like to add
.caption {
font-size : smaller;
font-style : italic;
}
to the style sheets to differ the image text from the body text. Perhaps the not used gimp-help-custom.css file is a good way of doing it, but as this wish may be unique to Norwegian only, how to add a conditional to select languages? (if LANG="nn" then ... else not) As far as I know it is not possible in the style sheet, but is there a clever/simple way of doing this. (Unless we add it to the common style sheets).
It is not very important to me to add this style, only a suggestion/wish. Kolbjoern

Ulf-D. Ehlert skreiv:

Kolbjørn Stuestøl (Monday, 29. March 2010)

I would like to add
.caption {
font-size : smaller;
font-style : italic;
}
to the style sheets to differ the image text from the body text.

Doesn't make italic font-style the caption text "too" different or too marked?

The intention was to give the image text another layout to distinguish it from the rest of the text. In books and other paper prints it is quite common to use a different font in italic for pictures. In my opinion it looks better, but others may disagree in this. Perhaps only one of the styles should be used, either "font-size: smaller" or "font-style: italics".

I am running the GIMP manual on Windows/Firefox or Windows/Opera. Perhaps other browsers gives a quite different display?

Perhaps the not used gimp-help-custom.css file is a good way of doing it, but as this wish may be unique to Norwegian only, how to add a conditional to select languages?

As far as I understand it, gimp-help-custom.css exists to provide a simple way for everybody to customize the manual; for example, if you (and only you) want to make the background blue or use some exotic font, you can add this stylesheet to your html files.

But with one drawback: As this stylesheet (gimp-help-custom.css) is called on top of every html file created, the style defined in this file will affect all users! Not only one specific language. (Yes, I know it is possible to define your own classes or whatever not used by others, but that's another question).

For an improvement like above, you should add your changes to the main stylesheet(s) (don't forget gimp22.css) if you think it's useful for everybody.

No problem if amended on this list. Some inputs?
(You may try it by copying the .caption {...} on top of this mail into a gimp-help-plain.css file and add this file to your local html folder).

Alternative: copy gimp-help-plain.css (and gimp22.css) to the (new) subdirectory stylesheets/nn and edit the copied stylesheets. This way only the Norwegian HTML manual would be affected.

Perhaps this is the best solution? Moving the gimp-help-plain.css and gimp22.css to separate language folders (as i.e. in po or images). Then the stylesheets would be explicit to each language, not affecting other languages and the gimp-help-plain.css would be living up to its intentions.

Kolbjoern

Bye,
Ulf

Ulf-D. Ehlert skreiv:

Kolbjørn Stuestøl (Monday, 29. March 2010)

The intention was to give the image text another layout to distinguish it from the rest of the text. In books and other paper prints it is quite common to use a different font in italic for pictures.

Yes, I just thought that italic is used to emphasize text.

That too

In my opinion it looks better, but others may disagree in this.

Then add it.

Some input from others?
Should we add it in the common stylesheets?

I am running the GIMP manual on Windows/Firefox or Windows/Opera. Perhaps other browsers gives a quite different display?

Just tested: it looks good using Konqueror (Linux). :-)

As far as I understand it, gimp-help-custom.css exists to provide a simple way for everybody to customize the manual; for example, if you (and only you) want to make the background blue or use some exotic font, you can add this stylesheet to your html files.

But with one drawback: As this stylesheet (gimp-help-custom.css) is called on top of every html file created, the style defined in this file will affect all users! Not only one specific language. (Yes, I know it is possible to define your own classes or whatever not used by others, but that's another question).

No, I meant to just create you personal stylesheet, don't commit/push it.

(You may try it by copying the .caption {...} on top of this mail into a gimp-help-plain.css file and add this file to your local html folder).

For testing on the fly gimp-help-custom.css is even better.

Sorry for confusing.
I used "automatic writing" and was not aware of that "gimp-help-custom.css" had changed to "gimp-help-plain.css". Of course it should be "gimp-help-custom.css" here and below.

Alternative: copy gimp-help-plain.css (and gimp22.css) to the (new) subdirectory stylesheets/nn and edit the copied stylesheets. This way only the Norwegian HTML manual would be affected.

Perhaps this is the best solution? Moving the gimp-help-plain.css and gimp22.css to separate language folders (as i.e. in po or images). Then the stylesheets would be explicit to each language, not affecting other languages and the gimp-help-plain.css would be living up to its intentions.

As long as the stylesheets don't differ we should avoid this, simply because we'd had to apply any later changes to every local stylesheet.

This special feature is more interesting for non-European languages IMHO.

My suggestion was that gimp-help-custom.css could be used to language specific styles. If Norwegian is the only language that would like to use the smaller font in italic in image texts, I could put the style in the /stylesheets/nn folder. Of course the Makefile in addition needs some conditionals to select the language specific files. ("if LANG=xx then copy stylesheets/xx/*.css to html").

As the gimp22.css is listed downmost in the html head tag it is not possible to override this style using the language dependent method.

I have to select the alternate style sheets (gimp22.css) for every single side and I am normally not using it. But perhaps some others does.

Again, sorry for my misleading misprint. Kolbjoern

Bye,
Ulf

Ulf-D. Ehlert skreiv:

Kolbjørn Stuestøl (Tuesday, 30. March 2010) [...]

As far as I understand it, gimp-help-custom.css exists to provide a simple way for everybody to customize the manual; for example, if you (and only you) want to make the background blue or use some exotic font, you can add this stylesheet to your html files.

But with one drawback: As this stylesheet (gimp-help-custom.css) is called on top of every html file created, the style defined in this file will affect all users! Not only one specific language. (Yes, I know it is possible to define your own classes or whatever not used by others, but that's another question).

And if we add a gimp-help-custom.css it will overwrite the user's stylesheet on every update.

That's why I think we should not add a gimp-help-custom.css for any purpose -- let the user add his own stylesheet if he wants to make some personal customizations.

It looks like we are talking a bit behind each other. Perhaps because my incomplete English.
I'll give it a new try.

I was not thinking of individual users which in my opinion does not think a second on formatting the help sides. They are reading the help files to learn something about GIMP. My intention was to give the *translators* a simple way to add a few extra styles in addition to and without affecting the common styles. Some language dependent fine tuning so to speak.

By now the file gimp-help-custom.css is not in use but added to each html head tag. (Perhaps as Ulf mentioned to get the individual user a chance to add his own style in a simple way?) I therefore suggested using this file if I would give my xx translation an additional style I then could write the extra style into the /stylesheets/xx/gimp-help-custom.css file without affecting the common style or styles specific to other languages. The common files could be changed without giving my language dependent file a thought. It is up to me (or the language team in most cases) to keep my special stylesheet up to date in case the changes affects my file.

For languages not using the language dependent gimp-help-custom.css this file will be empty or not existing. The user who wants to change the layout using this file will be an experienced user of style sheets having no problems to add the additional commands whether there are some existing text or not in the file.

Of course this solution gives the language team the freedom to completely rewrite the style. But if they do, it will in case affect the specific language only, not other users.

As written before, this is not an important matter for me. It was a suggestion only. So you may forget it if you want to.

My suggestion was that gimp-help-custom.css could be used to language specific styles. If Norwegian is the only language that would like to use the smaller font in italic in image texts, I could put the style in the /stylesheets/nn folder. Of course the Makefile in addition needs some conditionals to select the language specific files. ("if LANG=xx then copy stylesheets/xx/*.css to html").

This feature is still there, look for the string "Copying stylesheets":

for file in $(srcdir)/stylesheets/*.css \ $(srcdir)/stylesheets/$*/*.css; do \ if [ -f $${file} ]; then cp -f $${file} html/$*; fi; \ done

Any CSS file in an language-specific subdir is copied to html (and overwrites the general CSS file which is copied before).

As you know I am not a Unix/Linux programmer, and I have not stepped through the above sequence to see the contains of the variables. (As far as I remeber from previous discussions in this list, there is no simple step sequence in this programming language). But if this equation select the language specific files it could be used to distinguish between /stylesheets/xx. Then we already have a solution? (if we want to)

As the gimp22.css is listed downmost in the html head tag it is not possible to override this style using the language dependent method.

Unless the above code is broken, it is possible. Just copy and edit.

Again, I was thinking of what the program does, not the individual user.

I have to select the alternate style sheets (gimp22.css) for every single side [...]

This depends on the browser.

OK. I have to find out how.

Kolbjoern

Hi

It looks like the solution I wanted was already incorporated. Ran "make html-nn" and the file /stylesheets/nn/gimp-help-custom.css was copied to the html folder. Thereafter ran "make html-en" and the file stylesheets/nn/gimp-help-custom.css was not copied. I have not tested it on other languages yet. Sorry for being so incompetent. (But it led to an interesting discussion).

(My internet connection was down today (again), therefore a bit late). Kolbjoern