On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Sven Neumann wrote:

Hi,

I am glad that you guys are making good progress with the user manual. But the GIMP users would very much appreciate if you could try to put some focus on getting a release out. It's now almost a year since the GIMP 2.6.0 release and there's still no user manual for 2.6 that our users could download and install locally. We keep getting bug reports like this one http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=592948 and there's nothing we can about it unless you guys decide to roll a tarball and call it gimp-help-2.6.0. Could you do that, pretty please, with sugar on top?

True, but one thing that needs attention is that unlike with previous infrastructure *now* what we are going to see in translations is a lot of content in English, and not just in table of contents, but also in the middle of the text, even if just punctuation was changed. This is what users will probably not like :)

Alexandre

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 01:19:37PM +0400, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote:

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Sven Neumann wrote:

Hi,

I am glad that you guys are making good progress with the user manual. But the GIMP users would very much appreciate if you could try to put some focus on getting a release out. It's now almost a year since the GIMP 2.6.0 release and there's still no user manual for 2.6 that our users could download and install locally. We keep getting bug reports like this one http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=592948 and there's nothing we can about it unless you guys decide to roll a tarball and call it gimp-help-2.6.0. Could you do that, pretty please, with sugar on top?

True, but one thing that needs attention is that unlike with previous infrastructure *now* what we are going to see in translations is a lot of content in English, and not just in table of contents, but also in the middle of the text, even if just punctuation was changed. This is what users will probably not like :)

Users usually do not like even parts of the manual missing; though I'm not shure which is worse...

An easy solution (IMHO) could be to choose a point in time and simply freeze a version (like a string freeze for a program) then ask translator teams to complete their native language part in a fixed time span (say 2-3 weeks). Then commit a git version tag...say 2.6.0.

comments?

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 3:30 PM, Marco Ciampa wrote:

An easy solution (IMHO) could be to choose a point in time and simply freeze a version (like a string freeze for a program) then ask translator teams to complete their native language part in a fixed time span (say 2-3 weeks). Then commit a git version tag...say 2.6.0.

comments?

I do like the idea of freezing docs for translation.

Alexandre

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 8:32 AM, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote:

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 3:30 PM, Marco Ciampa wrote:

An easy solution (IMHO) could be to choose a point in time and simply freeze a version (like a string freeze for a program) then ask translator teams to complete their native language part in a fixed time span (say 2-3 weeks). Then commit a git version tag...say 2.6.0.

comments?

I do like the idea of freezing docs for translation.

Yes, sounds ok for me - even though there is no current pt_BR translation - I like to vbe ableto tell users around that there is an Englsh help.

But I think that a freeze + imediate release of an English only tarball, with a "other languages soon" advertised on the web would be a good thing.

js
->

Alexandre

Would it be possible to modify the "make html" so that fuzzy strings remain unchanged in the local version instead of being replaced with the English strings?

Before the migration to po, changes in English strings didn't change the other languages...

Julien

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Sven Neumann wrote:

Hi,

I am glad that you guys are making good progress with the user manual. But the GIMP users would very much appreciate if you could try to put some focus on getting a release out. It's now almost a year since the GIMP 2.6.0 release and there's still no user manual for 2.6 that our users could download and install locally. We keep getting bug reports like this one http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=592948 and there's nothing we can about it unless you guys decide to roll a tarball and call it gimp-help-2.6.0. Could you do that, pretty please, with sugar on top?

True, but one thing that needs attention is that unlike with previous infrastructure *now* what we are going to see in translations is a lot of content in English, and not just in table of contents, but also in the middle of the text, even if just punctuation was changed. This is what users will probably not like :)

Alexandre

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 09:50:15PM +0200, julien wrote:

Would it be possible to modify the "make html" so that fuzzy strings remain unchanged in the local version instead of being replaced with the English strings?

Before the migration to po, changes in English strings didn't change the other languages...

This could be potentially dangerous for the manual build process since it is not assured that fuzzy strings may compile without problems...

julien (Dienstag, 25. August 2009, 21:50):

Would it be possible to modify the "make html" so that fuzzy strings remain unchanged in the local version instead of being replaced with the English strings?

Of course it is possible, but do you really want this? Some fuzzy translations are useful (e.g. if a typo has been fixed in the English text). But some fuzzy translations are irritating, wrong, or completely nonsense...

What if the text was Warning:
If you press X before Y, GIMP will format your harddisk.
and the fuzzy translation was the translation of Warning:
Always press X before Y.
from a different file?

Before the migration to po, changes in English strings didn't change the other languages...

Yes, but we all knew the consequences of switching to a gettext-based system.

Ulf

Von: "Ulf-D. Ehlert"

What if the text was
Warning:
If you press X before Y, GIMP will format your harddisk.
and the fuzzy translation was the translation of Warning:
Always press X before Y.
from a different file?

You've got problem similar to this in the current help right now, without any fuzzy translations. If you want people to notice them, report them or maybe even contribute fixes, you should try to get a release out.

Michael

Sven Neumann (Donnerstag, 27. August 2009, 22:19):

Right. The consequence now is that a freeze is unavoidable if you want to get a release out.

Since there's no feedback from Roman, I suggest making a freeze next week, that is

Mon, 07 Sep 2009, 00:00:00 +0000 (UTC).

Then we (=anybody) create a branch (origin/gimp-help-2-6-0?) where no changes of the English text are allowed any more.

At this point Roman should be able to release an English HTML package, and localized HTML packages are released as soon as the respective translation is complete.

Is this okay with everybody?

Ulf

On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 02:51:42PM +0200, Ulf-D. Ehlert wrote:

Sven Neumann (Donnerstag, 27. August 2009, 22:19):

Right. The consequence now is that a freeze is unavoidable if you want to get a release out.

Since there's no feedback from Roman, I suggest making a freeze next week, that is

Mon, 07 Sep 2009, 00:00:00 +0000 (UTC).

Then we (=anybody) create a branch (origin/gimp-help-2-6-0?) where no changes of the English text are allowed any more.

At this point Roman should be able to release an English HTML package, and localized HTML packages are released as soon as the respective translation is complete.

Is this okay with everybody?

Ulf

Italian team (me), yes please!

Since there's no feedback from Roman, I suggest making a freeze next week, that is

Mon, 07 Sep 2009, 00:00:00 +0000 (UTC).

Ok for me.

Julien

Hi Ulf,

On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 02:51:42PM +0200, Ulf-D. Ehlert wrote:

Sven Neumann (Donnerstag, 27. August 2009, 22:19):

Right. The consequence now is that a freeze is unavoidable if you want to get a release out.

Since there's no feedback from Roman, I suggest making a freeze next week, that is
[...]

At this point Roman should be able to release an English HTML package, and localized HTML packages are released as soon as the respective translation is complete.

If you do the branch, I'm happy to make a release of the English version of the branch.

I've figured that the English HTML package might need a bit of tweakage, to add a few files (README, AUTHORS, License and stuff), but that might be something which should be discussed on a different thread.

Cheers,

2009? 8? 29? ????Ulf-D. Ehlert ????????:

I suggest making a freeze next week, that is

Mon, 07 Sep 2009, 00:00:00 +0000 (UTC).

Then we (=anybody) create a branch (origin/gimp-help-2-6-0?) where no changes of the English text are allowed any more.

It's being happy weeks indeed.
But I regret that I cannot send full Japanese version in few days after that day. Its progress degree is bare 87% (11420/13160 po entries).

I will work hard to fulfill this project so that it can be taken in the next release (2.6.1).

SimaMoto,RyôTa (????) , http://www.geocities.jp/ss2pxd1c/
http://code.google.com/p/gimp-doc-ja/ -------------------------------------- Thanks 10 years! Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions http://pr.mail.yahoo.co.jp/ec10years/

On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 4:51 PM, Ulf-D. Ehlert wrote:

Sven Neumann (Donnerstag, 27. August 2009, 22:19):

Right. The consequence now is that a freeze is unavoidable if you want to get a release out.

Since there's no feedback from Roman, I suggest making a freeze next week, that is

       Mon, 07 Sep 2009, 00:00:00 +0000 (UTC).

Then we (=anybody) create a branch (origin/gimp-help-2-6-0?) where no changes of the English text are allowed any more.

At this point Roman should be able to release an English HTML package, and localized HTML packages are released as soon as the respective translation is complete.

Is this okay with everybody?

Fine with me, can't speak for Vitaly :)

Alexandre